A goofy notation question

SOTSDO

SOTSDO

Old King Log
Staff member
CE/Moderator
I'm in the midst of suffering through Into The Woods, and while counting hundreds of bars of rests, I came across a music notation that I've never seen in a clarinet chart.

The bar in question has a quarter rest, two quarter notes, and a quarter rest. Each of the quarter notes has what I would call a "down bow" mark, drawing in the same way as I've seen in many a marked up string part.

The notation looks like a square version of the Greek letter ∏, much like that character there. Both quarter notes had this symbol over their heads, and there is no other notation in the measure in question. And, it is printed in the engraved clarinet part, not someone's addition to the music.

So, what is it? Have the habits of string players spilt over into the woodwind world. I can easily twitch my bell up here if that is what is called for. In our little group of twelve or so, half of which are music teachers or former music teachers, no one had the foggiest idea as to what they were for.

Oh, and Into The Woods sucks...
 
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It's a downbow. Nothing more, nothing less. Sombody has mistakenly left it in when copying a string part across.

It could also be used on a guitar part when instructing a guitarist to plectrum downwards rather than upwards, but I would never do that as I celebrrate guitarists who can read at all, and not worry about the plectrum direction nuances.

Although meaningless on a clarinet part I would interpret it to at least mean that both notes be given a equal weight, although I can't see why that wouldn't happen anyway.
 
pete thomas said:
... but I would never do that as I celebrate guitarists who can read at all, and not worry about the plectrum direction nuances.
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hmm yessss. :)
Personally Id play those notes sforzando; until someone notices and/or complains. [ Sotsdo: "But it's in the part" ].
Does it suck worse than The Red Mill ??
 
I don't know about the The Red Mill, so I can't comment there. I can say that it's worse than 110° In The Shade and 1776 and playing in the on-stage band (while dressed in period drag) in Cabaret.

But, I'm the guy who thinks highly of It's A Bird; It's A Plane; It's Superman!, so what do I know?
 
A single down bow, by itself is merely an indication of bow direction. A pair of them on adjacent notes is a style of attack, very hard aggressive articulation like saying Bop, Bop without the ending stop - this assumes there is no other marking influencing these indications.

This is the sound of a section doing repeated downbows at a brisk tempo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3e6CPLBZWI

This is the sound of a single violin dong the articulation - first 5 notes of the soloist's entrance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f67yYbauKJ8
 
Even if it was a notation crossover error in part extraction, odds are the articulation is being used by a string player at the same time. Worth a question to the MD.
 
But, there are no string parts as far as I can see. (We've got a guy on a synth playing off of a score of some sort.)

I'll look around and see what they have hiding in the box.
 
I played violin for that show, the parts do exist - and kick the synth player for me, would ja?
 
SOTSDO said:
I'm in the midst of suffering through Into The Woods, and while counting hundreds of bars of rests, I came across a music notation that I've never seen in a clarinet chart.

The bar in question has a quarter rest, two quarter notes, and a quarter rest. Each of the quarter notes has what I would call a "down bow" mark, drawing in the same way as I've seen in many a marked up string part.

The notation looks like a square version of the Greek letter ∏, much like that character there. Both quarter notes had this symbol over their heads, and there is no other notation in the measure in question. And, it is printed in the engraved clarinet part, not someone's addition to the music.

So, what is it? Have the habits of string players spilt over into the woodwind world. I can easily twitch my bell up here if that is what is called for. In our little group of twelve or so, half of which are music teachers or former music teachers, no one had the foggiest idea as to what they were for.

Oh, and Into The Woods sucks...
Click to expand...

Although Tunick did do the orchestration for Into The Woods, that weird bowing option on the clarinet was probably a mistake made by the music copyist. And just out of curiosity, why does Into The Woods​ suck for you?
 
Too thin of a musical group (no strings), too much overlap with something else (a seminar in Pensacola FL that I had to attend in order to deliver a few lectures; I ended up getting someone else to cover the part while I was needed there).

It's not a show I'll look forward to playing in the future. This year, the main burden looks like 1776 and Bye, Bye Birdie!. The first is pretty boring; the second is okay.
 
Well, sorry to hear about that. I hope the other two go fine. I've heard that 1776 has this 20 minute stop where there is no music. I did Bye Bye Birdie my sophomore year of high school and I was Hugo Peabody (whoops, hope I didn't spoil anything for ya), but that was because the person who was gonna play that part dropped out of the production. Now I don't mean to be rude, but you older woodwind folks seem to be a little picky about the Sondheim/Tunick duo. I've never played a Sondheim show, but it would be interesting to do one. And what do you guys like about the Tunick orchestrations anyway?
 
I did 1776 a few years back, and had a long trip to the theater each day, this after work. I just got there in time for the downbeat (with only the clarinet and the flute, it was an easy setup), but didn't have time to eat. However, during the long pause in the show, I was able to exit the pit (they have a ramp running down from backstage - a real quality setup, all around), climb in the car, drive a couple of miles to a fast food joint, purchase dinner, drive back, and eat dinner - all with time to spare.

I don't have anything specific against Sondheim - I like more of his shows that I don't. Through sung stuff like Into The Woods isn't as good as stuff like Forum or Assassins, at least in my eyes.

And Birdie is one that I've done seven or eight productions of in the past, so I'm used to the thing at this point. I even did it as music director once, way back in the day.
 
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