Adolphe Sax Alto: Currently $510

pete

pete

Brassica Oleracea
Staff member
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Another horn found when I was looking for something completely unrelated. As always, I mention them because I know that some of y'all want 'em and/or are interested to see how much value your horn might have increased, not because I'm selling them or even know the seller.
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The eBay Ad.

First, the serial number's not 2386, as mentioned in the ad. That dates to around 1843 (yes, I have a serial number chart). I can accept 23860, because that = 1862. I also happen to have pics of an 1861 alto and an horribly relacquered 1863 horn that look simular. (The earliest known A. Sax horn was built between 1843 and 1847 and had a serial number of 4634.)

There were two things that bothered me about this horn. The first was the incredibly wide bell. However, if you look at the examples I mention, above, there were some with a very wide bell. Most of the ones I'm used to aren't quite as exaggerated. The other thing was that the post-to-body plates were rectangular, rather than roundish. That, again, just looks like a whim of A. Sax: the 1861 bari that Groovekiller owns has this construction and I checked my other pics: it does seem random.

The engraving that remains looks close to what I've seen before.

The reason why I pause, a bit, on this horn is because I know that there were a LOT of folks that made A. Sax ripoffs after 1866. You don't want to put down big $ and find out that it's not really made by A. Sax. I do know the folks over at saxquest.com and I trust them to have done their due diligence.

It's disappointing that this example was either replated (as mentioned in the ad) or got so worn down over the years that the engraving is barely legible.

Anyhow, if one of y'all buy it, restore it and send me lots and lots of very large photos.

(I have a gallery of this horn on my website, as the eBay ad will go down in a month.)
 
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There is so much questionable about this instrument that it does give one pause. Makes me glad I'm out of the collecting game. (I have sold 22 instruments in the last 4 months.) Still, it would be wonderful to see this baby rebuilt, especially if SaxQuest has a rock-solid provenience on the instrument.
 
I do like the honesty: "I would expect a quality repair to run into the $1500 price range." Probably a bit more than that, depending on who you go to, because the tone holes need resoldering work. I've seen really, really bad resoldering work, so I'd definitely want someone who knows what he's doing.

I wonder if the horn could be de-plated, the bare brass polished, and re-engraved. That'd be best, I think.

$560, ATM, if you wanna take a shot at it.

I do wonder about the intonation standard, as that's a little random on these horns. I'd hope A=435hz, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was something else.
 
Somebody got a deal. I think it's worth $5,000 to $7,500.

Yes, it's been buffed hard and plated later. The serial number doesn't make sense. I think somebody buffed off a digit. Also, the low B keyguard is missing. But otherwise, it is all there.

Good stuff - It's an older model with the big bell (pre - 1867), thus rarer than most. The reinforcing ribs on the side of the neck are typical. It probably plays well at A=440, so it can be used in a modern ensemble. Later A=435 models are harder to set up to play at A=440. It's going to need a ton of work, but there's nothing to keep it from playing like new, and there are not many of these in existence.

The pictures are very interesting to me, for various reasons. The left thumb rest has a comfortable brass "button" surrounded by a larger brass flange. My 1861 Adolphe Sax baritone has exactly the same left thumb rest. I thought that maybe it was a later modification to cover up some damage, but now I think my horn and this one are original, as far as the left thumb rest goes.

The corks on the low key guards are exactly like the ones on my 1876 Adolphe Sax alto as I received it, mostly in original condition. That is, they are cork wrapped around the keyguard wire and secured with thread, and possibly glue. When I restored my 1876 alto, I used this type of corking on the wire keyguards, and now I'm glad I did.
 
That particular kind of cork is also found on a lot of 19th century Evette-Schaeffer horns. As they had an official license from A. Sax, they're probably the closest thing to compare with. I do know that around, oh, 1875ish, Evette-Schaeffer started playing more with their own design improvements.

Good stuff ya got there, Randy!
 
Until you pointed out the differences in the cork on the key guards, I hadn't noticed the difference. My Evette - Schaeffer bari (circa 1886) has the cork sans the wire. I guess this is the 2nd generation of cork bumper. Interesting. Thanks Randy & Pete.
 
The old keyguard corks were solid cork, drilled down the middle of the "cylinder," sliced lengthwise on one side and "snapped" onto the keyguard wire, sometimes secured with shellac, and sometimes tied in place with thread around the cork cylinder.

To make things easier, I start with flute head joint corks (already drilled), spin them down to size on a bench motor with sandpaper, and then copy what the guys did in 1850-1890.
 
Right now I wished I still lived on the East Coast. I'd sent my bari down to you and get you to restore it like you did your A. Sax.

I know you made your own pads, but I played my horn over the weekend, and the original pads are mostly all still OK. They are soft and supple. They seal well still. It needs corks, and a proper adjustment. Some pads perhaps, but not a lot.

A friend from the interior of BC stopped by yesterday, on his way home from the Coast. It turns out he has a nickle plated, Conn HP bari circa 1890s or so. Also double octave key. He's going to send me pics. I suggested that we do a HP bari duet. Now that would be a lot of fun.
 
The east coast of North America is fairly large. If you just switched coasts, you'd still be pretty far from Randy ;)

I'd second the idea of an all A=457 group. That'd be interesting.
 
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