Well, look at what Monsieur Marigaux did unto my clarinet...
Well, look at what Monsieur Marigaux did unto my clarinet...
I think that it comes down to cost, just like so much else. Quite aside from the material costs (i.e., you still have to have enough wood there to make a regular socket, except now you cut some of it away and then have to fit the metal socket), you also end up with sealing issues that a standard wooden socket and ring avoid completely.
Plus, there's always tradition...
Plus, there's always tradition...
copy cat!!! Monsieur Marigaux
Not having that many clarinets through my hands I am not aware of the quirks across the board. From an engineering angle, not cost, is the sleeve not a better proposition, assuming the cork on the tenon is always in good condition? (Otherwise I can see friction letting it down and the parts sliding apart!!)
Not having that many clarinets through my hands I am not aware of the quirks across the board. From an engineering angle, not cost, is the sleeve not a better proposition, assuming the cork on the tenon is always in good condition? (Otherwise I can see friction letting it down and the parts sliding apart!!)
a full metal sleeve is not new. My Selmer CT has it
http://www.clarinetperfection.com/galleryclar/tenons/ct2.jpg
you can see in the pic, just barely, 1 of 3 screws at the base of the socket which keeps it attached. On the CT though the socket is longer as it also is there for an articulated G# (tonehole through the socket)
http://www.clarinetperfection.com/galleryclar/tenons/ct2.jpg
you can see in the pic, just barely, 1 of 3 screws at the base of the socket which keeps it attached. On the CT though the socket is longer as it also is there for an articulated G# (tonehole through the socket)
Couple updates added to the first post.
I had thought I posted this. I guess I didn't.
This Horn was Owned by A Famous Person
Unless you have signed documentation that your Famous Person owned and played the horn, I don't care who you say owned it: I can't prove it, thus the horn doesn't get a value bump.
This Horn was Passed Down to Me from my Grandfather's Mother's Hairdresser's Aunt
Being blunt, nobody cares -- unless the person that owned and played the horn is someone famous and you can document it. Again, "old" does not equal "valuable."
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There's also a small twist on "famous." (See my original thread on this.)
There are several "generations" of famous saxophone players and the older the generation is, the less value that the famous person's name is going to impart. An example I generally give is that Charlie Parker's Grafton alto sax -- a horn that was intended to be a student horn, no less -- sold for hundreds of thousands of $ a few years back. Coleman Hawkins, a gentleman from the generation before Parker, who was probably as famous as Parker (in his era) and had two models of saxophone named after him, had his gold plated Selmer professional horn up on eBay. It sold for $10,000 a few years back. In other words, Parker's horn went for about 150 times more than the horn was worth if there wasn't that association with someone famous. Being generous, Hawkins' horn only sold for about 4 times more than the horn was worth, alone. Go back another generation and you'd probably see even less of a multiplier.
This Horn was Owned by A Famous Person
Unless you have signed documentation that your Famous Person owned and played the horn, I don't care who you say owned it: I can't prove it, thus the horn doesn't get a value bump.
This Horn was Passed Down to Me from my Grandfather's Mother's Hairdresser's Aunt
Being blunt, nobody cares -- unless the person that owned and played the horn is someone famous and you can document it. Again, "old" does not equal "valuable."
===============
There's also a small twist on "famous." (See my original thread on this.)
There are several "generations" of famous saxophone players and the older the generation is, the less value that the famous person's name is going to impart. An example I generally give is that Charlie Parker's Grafton alto sax -- a horn that was intended to be a student horn, no less -- sold for hundreds of thousands of $ a few years back. Coleman Hawkins, a gentleman from the generation before Parker, who was probably as famous as Parker (in his era) and had two models of saxophone named after him, had his gold plated Selmer professional horn up on eBay. It sold for $10,000 a few years back. In other words, Parker's horn went for about 150 times more than the horn was worth if there wasn't that association with someone famous. Being generous, Hawkins' horn only sold for about 4 times more than the horn was worth, alone. Go back another generation and you'd probably see even less of a multiplier.
. (Point acknowledged, though.)
Then too, museums acquire things for different reasons than do regular people.
An example is the test tube in the Ford Museum complex up in Dearborn, said to contain (as they say in the shipping industry) the last breath of Thomas A. Edison.
Total physical worth: $1.00 for the tube, less for the stopper. (The last breath is long time diluted, by the way - despite what happens when you wear your galoshes, rubber is not a completely impermeable substance, and gas molecules pass through it, albeit slowly)
Actual worth (to the museum, and probably to most others interested in the past); considerably more.
Even though it's a student horn, the fact that it was played by a famous jazz dude enhances the value all out of proportion to its worth to other musicians.
Put another way, while I would never buy a horn as an "investment", someone took a chance on that Grafton and realized a chunk of change. Their risk, their reward, and more power to them for moving something of marginal "real" value to a musician, but of considerable intangible value to the right party.
An example is the test tube in the Ford Museum complex up in Dearborn, said to contain (as they say in the shipping industry) the last breath of Thomas A. Edison.
Total physical worth: $1.00 for the tube, less for the stopper. (The last breath is long time diluted, by the way - despite what happens when you wear your galoshes, rubber is not a completely impermeable substance, and gas molecules pass through it, albeit slowly)
Actual worth (to the museum, and probably to most others interested in the past); considerably more.
Even though it's a student horn, the fact that it was played by a famous jazz dude enhances the value all out of proportion to its worth to other musicians.
Put another way, while I would never buy a horn as an "investment", someone took a chance on that Grafton and realized a chunk of change. Their risk, their reward, and more power to them for moving something of marginal "real" value to a musician, but of considerable intangible value to the right party.