Leblanc Paris Bass Clarinet - tech magnet

Gandalfe

Gandalfe

Striving to play the changes in a melodic way.
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My grandson has been playing my Leblanc Paris bass clarinet (vintage 60s horn) for three years now. At 14 he is very careful with the instrument, takes lessons from me and a pro instructor. But he never practices unless we do it together and can't play the clarion range above A3. For that matter, neither can I reliably on this instrument--I have absolutely no problem with my Selmer Privilege 67.

I have this into the tech three to four times a year and these are good techs. It's always something new and as far as I can tell is not from misuse. If Nicky luv'd music more I might buy him a better instrument. He ends up using the school loaner (while his is in the shop). It's a Yamaha student model, but it is in worse condition than his/mine.

He has a killer mouthpiece (Walter Grabner) and his sound is strong and sounds great until he gets to the clarion range. It's so bad that his teacher has asked him to bring a soprano clarinet to lessons so that he can make some progress.

His band teacher makes a lot of allowance for this kid; he's failing in almost every class in school and has gotten what amounts to a social pass every year since fifth grade. I hate to get another bass clarinet, don't want to lend him mine, and am loath to buy yet another instrument that will not get used when he finally gets the gumption to tell me to shove it.

His parents could care less about him and are now divorced. He lives at my house 4 or 5 days a week as I am working with him to become self sufficient and raise his grades. I've had some success but when I went on vacation for two week, he missed four days of school, missed a concert, and did absolutely no homework. So the fourth quarter was a wash.

Should I just keep doing maintenance on the horn even though it won't play well above A3, rent another horn, or what? Sigh, it was much easier with my kids. One horn plus a double lasted them their whole music career through high school.
 
Sounds like a worthwhile project. Maybe a different tech is in order here.
 
Sounds like it needs another visit to a tech.

I wouldn't invest in a new horn for him. I have seen one player play an old LeBlanc like that and they also played on the Grabner. No issues with the combination.
 
I have only overhauled 3 bass clarinets, all 3 were Leblancs of that era, but 2 of them had a bent rod in the register mechanism. As you unscrewed the rod, the keys danced around doing a little jig. It meant that sometimes the topmost register pad sealed, and sometimes it didn't. If it didn't - well not a good sound! A quick straightening of the rod (using a hand drill and a piece of wood with a hole in it) sorted that out. Worth checking that out - you will know in a couple of turns - you don't have to take the rod out at all.

Another essential and sometimes tricky regulation is the bridge. It has to be exact. If not, then either the auxillary key on the upper joint, or the aux key on the lower joint is held off from sealing. Sometimes this can be sensitive to the exact position it is assembled too, as a slight rotation clockwise or anticlockwise can alter the regulation if the either component of the bridge mechanism is not flat to its opposite number.

Is there movement in the keywork along the long axis? All loose motion of the keys should be taken up so there is not any stray movement of the pad on the tone hole. There is an easy cheating fix for that using tiny pellets of plumbers PTFE tape as described by Tom Ridenour, for keys held by point screws. It is a matter of swedging the ones with rods onto the rods.

Apart from that it is the usual obsessive checking of the pad sealing with a sliver of fine cigarette paper all around the pad. Although it is a tiny aperture, it is really important to use a point of this paper to check the register pip all around, as it can look like it is sealing, but can leak unless perfect.

As my tech says, there are three key words when doing this work - picky, picky, picky. It has to be perfect, or it just doesn't work.

Chris
 
Some of those type of bass clarinets are harder to play in that area. Some players can easily play the entire range on a better instrument (like a pro model Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha) but struggle with one of those old or student models. Not always, but usually the problem in this case is the player (if there's no adjustment problem with the instrument). It is a good idea to check with a very good bass clarinet player so they try the instrument.

Also, some of those very old instruments are in bad condition and have pretty fundamental mechanical problems. A lot of times it is expensive to fix and many people won't invest in that repair for such an instrument, so to still make it playable there is no choice but to live with the poor "foundations" of the mechanics. This means that for example the instrument can get out of adjustment a lot more often.

I would consider going with this kid to a store to try something like the Yamaha 221 and maybe even the Jupiter student models and see how he (and you) manage in the entire range on these instruments. If there's a problem (assuming no adjustment problem with the instruments) then you know the problem is the playing. The Yamaha is a bit easier than Jupiter but both should be possible (I actually prefer the Yamaha over many old Leblancs).
 
I know nothing about bass clarinets other than that I love the sound of them. However, it seems like you are all your grandson has to hang onto, and that music might be a way for him to get on with life. In that sense, a new, easier to play instrument may be a way forward not just musically but also personally. Perhaps if he didn't have an issue with playing the instrument and could play it at school, he might feel a lot better about himself. I am not an expert but my sense is that some of these kids end up feeling that they are good at nothing and therefore that there is no point in trying. In don't know, no clue actually. It is just a thought.
 
Steen, you get it. Music is the only thing that I've been able to get this kid invested in. He plays drums (poorly) in a garage band and sings too. So, what's a couple thousand dollars if it means the kid will stick with the instrument a little longer. Every year he tries to drop band, it only gets discovered when I have to sign the parent consent for the choosen courses.

Still it irks me that this instrument is not working with all the money I've put into it over the last three years. And it started with a complete overhaul and rebuild. I should have started with a newer instrument; now I know. His alto sax and clarinet (thanks Steve Sklar) have been problem-less.
 
You are doing the right things. At some point it is likely that something will click for him and he'll find that passion that drives a lot of us.
 
...my head is still smoking (Nomad, anyone?) from the contradicting statements "clarion range" and "A3". A3 is the one on the second ledger line below the (treble clef) staff, A4 is roughly mid-staff and A5 is on the 1st ledger above.
The only A in the clarion is A5 which is "near altissimo", at least for a bass (I had maybe ten notes of this and higher in the whole last winter concert).

In my experience, the left hand notes below the altissimo are a PITA if one of the pads round there has the tiniest leak, be it from a badly sealing pad or be it from being pushed open by air pressure or as "collateral damage" from other pads opening. Last but not least - the wood itself may be leaking somewhere "up there", eg round the neck tenon.
 
To be clear, I've never understood the note+number thang and use A3 to mean the third playable A on this instrument which puts it at the first A above the staff. That *should* be playable on a bass clarinet. It certain is on my Selmer and so is the A4 using the same nomenclature.

I'm sorry, that's just the way I feel. All my instruments can play every note it is keyed for. If it couldn't, it was traded in. I thought that's the way most musicians felt. I could be wrong.

NOTE: Posting this to a new thread as I'd like to understand the naming process better.
 
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Ben, the way Gandalfe used (i.e. the third A on the instrumeny) is how I noticed most sax players do. The advantages is it makes more sense for the instrument, but it also can be different for a family (for example clarinet vs. bass clarinet).

Gandalfe, relaly best to try something like a student Yamaha 221. If no problem, maybe consider selling the Leblanc and buy a Yamaha 221. If still a problem, it is the player.
 
I've spent considerable time on old "professional" Leblancs, and (while playable) they were always a crapshoot when it came to the high end of things. For that matter, the spread from the break to E in the staff were also "chancy", compared to Selmer pro products (or Buffets).

Having said that, a decent Yamaha would be the ticket to reliability, even if not my first choice.

Also, being an older Leblanc means that (if it's a pro horn) that you will have to deal with the fork Eb. This was a perpetual source of trouble for me in my Leblanc experiences.
 
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