I'm new and I want to get to know people who have good knowledge on the Sax.

Discussion in 'Introducing Yourself' started by Mmayoff683, Mar 1, 2016.

  1. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    Hi, I'm a college student who has been playing sax for 6 years and would love to know more about the sax. I own four saxes the first being a soprano sax the model is a Venus, and from what I know its a cheap and durable Taiwan made horn. My next horn is a alto sax King 660 brand new barely played mostly because my next horn is a Mark VI alto sax that is in really great condition and I constantly play it. The horn was my great-grandfather's and he played it starting from the 50s all the way to the 90s. It had to be repaired a couple years back when my grandfather and I found it in his attic but other wises the horn is legit and in great condition. My last horn is a Dolnet tenor sax, nothing special as far as I know about it and it works pretty well after I repaired it. I hope to get to know whoever responds back thanks!
     
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  2. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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  3. Gandalfe

    Gandalfe Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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  4. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    I play with the Diablo Valley College Jazz Band, and the Vallejo Community Jazz band.
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Clarinet CE/Moderator Staff Member CE/Moderator

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    we have a serial number list somewhere for saxes.

    What type of information were you searching for with your saxes ?
     
  6. Helen

    Helen Content Expert Saxophones Staff Member Administrator

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    What exactly are you looking to find out about saxophones Mmayoff683? I'd be happy to help you out in whatever way I can, but first I'd have to know what kind of info you're looking for.

    The links in my signature give you some clues to my areas of interest, and saxpertise... groan...:wink:
     
  7. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    I was interested on My Dolnet tenor sax, I know very little about the horn except that it is categorized as a Bel Air.
     
  8. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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    Well, you've at least seen my old website, then.

    I eventually found a Dolnet catalog that had pics of the style of horns I called called "Bel Air." The official name is "Artist." That's not very inventive, I must say. The only other new thing I've discovered is that Dolnet produced high pitch horns up until the M70 model in 1970 -- and didn't label their horns as HP or low pitch. So, if you're having extraordinary intonation problems, you probably have a high pitch horn.

    Other trivia: the Artist horns originally had red pads with screw-in large metal resonators. The resos are similar to what Buffet used on the Dynaction and SuperDynaction horns.
     
  9. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    I remember before I got the horn repaired it had red pads. But they were shredded to the point of having to replace every single one because the horn had not been played in 20 years. After the repair I noticed the tone of the horn was a lot warmer sounding compared to a video of the same horn being played some 20 years ago. So I'm guessing the price on the horn has dropped.
     
  10. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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    Oh. You're talking about value. That's a little different.

    Personally, if you like the horn, I wouldn't worry about it. Dolnet's not a big name like Selmer and are valued accordingly. Also, if I really wanted a Dolnet, I'd probably get it overhauled how I wanted it, so the pad condition wouldn't mean much to me.

    (I'd like to try an M70, just because of how the keywork is offset. Dunno if I'd like it, but I'd like to try it.)

    My opinion is that horns are usually designed with a particular setup in mind and you'll probably maximize the horn's "goodness" by sticking to that setup. So, if I needed to get a repad on, say, the Dynaction I owned, I'd try to get similar pads and resos. But that's, like, just my opinion, man.

    At the top of this page there's a menu in orange that says, "How much is my horn worth?" That can give you some specific information. Dolnet Artist models are common enough that finding another horn for sale in approximately the same condition as yours so you can determine monetary value shouldn't be a problem.
     
  11. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    Ok thanks. Any advice on what kind of bari sax I should be looking for that isn't to highly priced or poorly made and cheap.
     
  12. Gandalfe

    Gandalfe Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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  13. Steve

    Steve Clarinet CE/Moderator Staff Member CE/Moderator

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    I actually was tracking a Dolnet Low-A bari sax for a while on eBay. In mint-ish condition but no one was buying at $1900.
    It's one of those lost in history french brands unless you recall them from back then.
     
  14. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    Oh wow was the horn legit because it is Ebay, you never know what you find there.
     
  15. Mmayoff683

    Mmayoff683

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    Oh wow a YBS 52 those aren't bad at all you got my interest in the horn now thanks!
     
  16. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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    For that price, the YBS-52 is an excellent deal. Remember to mention us so we get kickbacks 'n' stuff.

    I owned a YBS-52 for a few years and I bought it new. They're almost $5500 now.

    Also, there's a *decent* Keilwerth-made Bundy for $900. I bet that if you threw $1900 at it (i.e. to equal the price from Quinn's YBS-52), it'd be an excellent horn. Source: I owned one of these, too. It is a low Bb horn, tho.

    Interestingly, there are a lot of good baris on eBay ATM that are a little broken down, but could be made into really good horns for a total price of under $3000.
     
  17. Helen

    Helen Content Expert Saxophones Staff Member Administrator

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    Mmmm.... Not too highly priced, poorly made, and cheap? All those qualities in a bari? That will be hard to find. Although not impossible. For example:

    I was lucky enough to get a silver plated Martin Committee III, low Bb bari that my tech had in on consignment. I managed to negotiate down the asking price because it needed a full overhaul. After my tech overhauled it for me, and including a new Protec case, the horn cost me $2,000 Cdn.

    That was a smokin' hot deal, since: 1. Most vintage baris have been beat to hell and have had lots of repairs, and this one is nearly pristine, 2. The finish is highly unusual, 3. The price was really good for this horn, since a matching tenor was just listed by a vintage sax dealer for $2050, and sold in under a week.

    My point is, good deals in vintage horns do come along--and I wasn't even the market for a new bari--but sometimes you have to wait for one to pop up. With baris the wait is often longer, since there are fewer of them to begin with.

    A few questions you have to ask yourself are:

    • Do you want a horn with modern keywork? (My Martin would not be considered modern keywork.)
    • Do you want a low A or low Bb horn?
    • How much $ do you have for repairs after it arrives? It's fine to get a $800 beater bari, but if you have to soak a $1000 overhaul into it, have you got that kind of cash?

    The YBS-52 would be a nice horn, and if you buy it from Quinn, you know what you're getting. Whereas if you're buying it from someone unknown on eBay, there is an element of risk involved.

    With Quinn you know he has what he says he has, and he is legit. His stuff is as described. And if you do buy from him, mention you are a member of the Woodwind Forum, and that you heard about him here.

    So to sum up, figure out the answers to the questions I asked, and from there, broaden your search. If possible, try a few baris in your area.

    Even if they are not for sale, see if you can try a bari with modern key work (post Selmer Mark VI), and compare it to a bari from before the Mark VI era. Is there someone you know who plays bari whose sax you can try? Go to a music store, they will most likely have a modern bari, if they have any at all.

    FWIW, my Martin with its vintage keywork replaced my Mark VI as my main bari, despite the Selmer having much better ergos. Why? The sound. The Martin has the sound I am looking for in my day to day playing. I just got used to the weird ergos of the Martin and can get around on it just as easily as I can on my Selmer. For me, vintage keywork and ergos are not a big deal, but then I play nothing but vintage horns. But that's a personal choice, you have to try it for yourself and figure out what works for you, and what you can get used to.
     
  18. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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    Kind of phenomenally lucky :). $2000 Canadian is like $1.50 US. It's also especially lucky because it played in good tune. I also love the Martin Committee "III" sound. I've just not been able to get one with good intonation.

    FWIW, ever since I played a Conn 30M tenor, I'm interested in playing a 12M bari from around the same time. The 30M really blew me away ...

    Quinn is good for lotsa reasons:

    * Lots and lots of feedback/sales.
    * Respected member of the sax community.
    * He's supported this website and my calendar projects for quite awhile.
    * Gandalfe knows where he lives, if you get a bad horn.
    * He's going to honestly say what's wrong with the horn.
    * He'll charge a pretty fair price.

    Still, the opportunity to get a decent to really good horn cheap and then overhaul the heck out of it for a total outlay of cash well under $2500 ... that's quite tempting.

    It looks like someone is taking my advice because that Keilwerth-made Bundy has been sold :D.

    ================

    EDIT: I should also say that the style of keywork really doesn't matter after you're used to the horn. Mostly. I've got a left pinkie that's been broken for me a couple times, so the G#/C#/B/Bb cluster is a concern for me. Older horns may also have forked Eb fingerings, G# trills, altissimo D# trills and more, which is not necessarily an asset or a bad thing.

    In the bari sax world, if you're looking for a good used horn, you should expect to be paying at least around that $2500 - $3000 mark, after all repairs.

    Of course, also remember that you want a decent mouthpiece. Those aren't exactly cheap for the bari.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 11, 2016
  19. Gandalfe

    Gandalfe Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    And the YAS-52 bari is sold. Bari saxes tend to go fast. There is another one on eBay available from Sam Ash but it starts at a $1000 more!
     
  20. pete

    pete Brassica Oleracea Staff Member Administrator

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    As I said, it was a good price.

    * ATM, probably the best bari under $2500 + Buy it Now on eBay may be Dave Kessler's SBS-201 -- there are more available through his website. While I am a bit iffy on Taiwanese and Chinese horns, particularly big horns, I'm not iffy on Dave and the horn's got a 3 day trial. And you can finance it ...
    * Looks like Mark over at Saxquest has two different Dolnet low Bb baris for $2000, if you're interested in that. Both have minor damage and one has a replacement neck.
    * WorldWideSax has a restored Keilwerth-made, low Bb Bundy for $2399.

    There is a $3000 Mark VI bari on eBay. It's going to need a lot of work, but it would arguably be worth it. I'll also note that it has a non-original neck, but most of the folks that build replacement necks make them specifically for Selmers.

    Oh. I didn't mention some baritones that are cheaper but are really early models: early 1930s and earlier. I ignored them because a) they can be a bit problematic to play and b) I really do think that the horns listed above are an awful lot better for not much more. I also ignored some refinished horns. I'm always a bit iffy when I hear "new finish."

    ===========

    As an aside, it'd be nice to do this kind of research every week -- a list of good horns at good prices. However, the only reason I'm doing it today is because I took my headache meds 45 min ago and I don't quite trust myself to do coding on my blog ...
     

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