Rudy Vallee C Melody on eBay ...

[pete]

... or not?

Here's the ad. $10K.

I sent the seller an e-mail because I wanted to see if he had anything that actually proves that the horn listed there was owned and played by Mr. Vallee. All I can see is a poorly written photo of a letter where the seller insists that this is Mr. Vallee's horn. That's like me insisting that I have a sax owned by John Coltrane. Really. I do.

Also note that the horn's a Conn Pan-American stencil -- the 1917 patent date confirms that. I'd date it mid-1920s, not late 19-teens, as the ad claims.

Well, at least nobody's bid on it ....

 

[Helen]

I think C melody saxophones should be worth this regardless of who owned them. Mind you, that might be because I own 2 of them that I don't play, and I'd be open to selling at least one of them for that price.

 

[pete]

I've had some back-and-forth with the seller, trying to determine what evidence there is to support that Vallee owned or played this. Gimmee a few minutes ....

 

[pete]

Do you actually have any documentation that this horn was owned and played by Rudy Vallée? The letter that you have photographed in this ad doesn't say anything about Mr. Vallée actually giving it to Mr. Berle.

Yes. The letter says it was given to Phil Berle by Rudy Vallee and inherited from the Phil Berle estate to the recipient who asked us to sell it for her.

And who are the signatories of the letter? Rudy Vallee or just the recipient?

The recipient is still alive and I can reach her telephonically. If you would like a notarized letter from her with the full provenance I am sure it can be obtained for you.

What I'm reading in your e-mails is that Phil Berle asserted in his will that this was Rudy Vallee's saxophone and that you have no documentation beyond that. If I'm mistaken, I'd love to see something from Rudy Vallee or his estate that certifies that this was his horn and he played it.

There is nothing like that because the saxophone was given to him by Rudy Vallee while Rudy Vallee was alive during World War 2.

Emphasis mine.

Summary:
"We're selling a saxophone that Phil Berle says was Rudy Vallee's. He willed the horn to a third party. The third party wants to sell it. We have no written documentation that this horn was from Rudy Vallee."

or

Scam. Do not want.

 

[pete]

Last point:

I received an e-mail the same day that I saw this ad. The person wanted to know how much a horn she inherited from a "well known" player was worth. My bottom line on that was: the horn is only going to have added value from the player's name if and only if you can document that he both owned and played it. She sent me a follow-up e-mail saying that she believed I was probably right about that and didn't have any documentation.

Related to this, and I mentioned this to my above e-mailer, is that your "big name player" isn't necessarily a "big name player" anymore.

The standard that a lot of people hold saxophone sales to is the sale of Charlie Parker's saxophones. His Grafton -- and note that the Grafton was not intended as a pro horn, but as a low-cost introductory horn -- sold for about $140,000. His King Super 20 -- a pro horn -- sold for about $260,000. However, if you go a generation earlier, Coleman Hawkins' gold-plated Selmer Super Series horn sold for under $10,000 on eBay a few years back. This is the Coleman Hawkins that even had a saxophone model named after him -- while he was alive -- and actually played said model (unlike, say, Rudy Wiedoeft and the Holton Wiedoeft model). Arguably, he was as big or bigger than Parker ... but was from a generation earlier. Of course, Rudy Vallee is from a few years earlier than Hawkins, so you'd assume one of his horns might be worth even less.

Also, in my research, I came across the auction for John Coltrane's saxophones in 2005. These were horns he definitely played, but I didn't see anything that specified anything like, say, the soprano was used for the recording of "My Favorite Things." The horns were brought to auction and failed to meet the reserve of $500,000.

Well, President Clinton's saxophones only sold in the $30,000 range ....

 

[SOTSDO]

Perhaps...

...if they threw a megaphone in with the deal; maybe you'd bite then.

I once wore Warren Harding's straw hat, but (like Vallee) that bit of historical association is not likely to be remembered past my death. My former mother-in-law was actually kissed by Harding when he passed through Saint Louis on his way west to Alaska and his death. (She was a babe in arms at the time.) She never dined out on the experience.

And, I've actually shaken hands with disgraced Vice President Spiro Agnew. No free meals there.

Topping all of this, my wife was briefly considered as a blind date for the Unabomber. He roomed with her future brother-in-law when he was attending university in IL, and he was going to be "brought home" at Christmas one year; something came up and he never made it. I like to throw this out when conversation wanes at a gathering - it always gets the talk going again.

Celebrity has a way of fading as time passes. All of the Harding stuff that I've researched over the years is of very limited interest to a very few people. Who cares about Agnew at this remove? Even the Unabomber has faded from the public eye.

In twenty years, saxophonists will probably recall little of Marcel Mule, Charlie Barnet (my saxophone (and sex) hero), certainly Rudy Vallee (who was primarily a vocalist, remember) or even Gerry Mulligan. It's all grist for the great mill of time.

 

[Helen]

It seems it's back again...

Still 10K. Still a Pan American stencil horn. Still not making any sense...

 

[pete]

But someone did make an offer. That might have been me, as I offered my 2 cents' worth ....