The keys are probably made of Neusilber, which oxidises to a dull grey. Aka nickel silver. Had a couple of keys on my son's clarinet fixed by the tecchy. He used silver solder. Then buffed it. Key came up like new. The fix was almost invisible. You'll need a lot of heat.
tárogató Remanufactured Part C
- Thread starter jbtsax
- Start date
More tárogató key making
A lot of work has taken place since I last posted about this project. The photos and text below will illustrate the steps involved in making of two keys for the bottom joint. The first series is the low C key.
The first step is reaming the key's hinge tube to accept the new size threaded rod.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Reaminghingetubetonewsize.jpg
Like most of the keys the hinge tube is badly bent. Unfortunately reaming the key does not straighten it at the same time. The bend is found by inserting the hinge rod into each end and marking the place where it meets resistance. The area between the marks shows where the primary bend is located.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Markingtheareaofthebentsection.jpg
The key is then tapped with a plastic mallet at that location with the hinge rod inside the tube. That is very important! The plastic mallet I am using was made from a screwdriver handle and a drum stick. The trick is knowing which direction to hit the tubing and how hard. This technique sometimes requires a lot of patience.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Usingplasticmallettostraightenbenthingetube.jpg
Once the rod moves freely in the hinge tube, the ends are "faced" using a hinge tube cutter in the bench motor. Some techs like to do this turning the chuck by hand. I like to hit and release the foot switch and let the cutter "kiss" the key just before it comes to a stop. I seem to get a more even and controlled cut that way.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Facingthehingetubewithcuttingtool.jpg
The fit of the key between the posts is continuously checked as the hinge tube is shortened. One tries to find the "sweet spot" where there is no lateral motion of the key and no friction when it rotates.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Checkingthefitofthehingetube.jpg
Once the key is fit, the old key "dish" is removed using a cutting disk on a dremel tool. I found that a lid to a plastic storage box helped to keep the metal shavings from my face, eyes, and hair.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Cuttingkeydishoffbehindplasticwindow.jpg
The key cup from the donor key is unsoldered.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Unsolderingkeycupfromdonorkey-1.jpg
The key is put on the tárogató to determine the position of the cup.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Checkingthepositionofthenewkeycup.jpg
The outline of the rib is scribed onto the key cup to position it for brazing.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thepositionscribedonthekey.jpg
The "third hands" are used to position the key for braising.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Holdingthepositionofthekeyforbrazing.jpg
The last photo in this series shows the key after it has been filed, sanded, and buffed. All that remains is to degrease and nickle plate the key since a new roller and small threaded rod have already been made.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Keyafterfinishingsteps.jpg
The very last key on the tárogató posed a special problem in that no key cups could be found that would fit. Shown below is a very low tech way to make a key cup when one does not have access to a metal lathe. The material used is a sheet of .035" thick brass.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Circledrawnonbrasssheet-1.jpg
A circle is cut out using metal shears (or tin snips) which is then heated to anneal the brass making it more pliable.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Annealingbrasscutout.jpg
The photo below shows the brass disk next to a hole bored into a piece of oak using a Forstner drill bit that will be used to shape the key cup.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Annealedbrassnexttoholeinmapleboard.jpg
A deep socket slightly smaller than the diameter of the hole is used to force the brass disk into the hole. Remember I said up front that this is very low tech.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Forcingthebrassintotheholeusingadeepsocketandhammer.jpg
Below is the shape of the brass following this step.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thebrassaftershaping.jpg
The part is super glued to a wooden dowel to spin the "little brass hat" in the bench motor to cut off the "ruffles".
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thecupportioniscutoutjewelerssax.jpg
The sides are then formed around the deep socket using a small dent hammer and the edges are smoothed by using a file as the cup which is now tight to the socket spins in the bench motor.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Shapingandformingthesidesofthecup.jpghttp://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Smoothingandroundingtheedgeswithafile.jpg
The key cup is still not ready to become part of the tárogató since its top is flat. All the other key cups have a slight curvature or dome on the top. Another low tech solution is found to help shape the top of the key cup. First pellets of Jett-Plastiform are heated in very hot water.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Meltingplastiformpelletsinhotwater.jpg
This forms a pliable plastic "goo" that is then rolled into a ball on waxed paper so it doesn't stick.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Plastiformrolledintoaballonwaxpaper.jpg
A wooden craft ball is pressed into the plastiform to create a bowl shape in the center. Did I mention this is real low tech?
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Usingawoodedbeadtoformabowlinplastic.jpg
When the plastiform cools, it turns into a hard white surface. The same wooden ball on a dowel is now tapped into the key cup positioned over the bowl causing the brass to conform to the curve.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Tappingthekeycupintobowltoconformtoitsshape.jpg
Here the rounded key cup is being checked for size on the tárogató.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Roundedkeycupcheckedforfit.jpg
This last photo shows how the last key looks on the tárogató after all of the finishing has been completed. Hooray!!! This part is done. The next installment will be about making and finishing toneholes.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Misc038.jpg
Disclaimer: None of the above contains any original ideas. Everything has been copied or adapted from other techs that I have learned from.
A lot of work has taken place since I last posted about this project. The photos and text below will illustrate the steps involved in making of two keys for the bottom joint. The first series is the low C key.
The first step is reaming the key's hinge tube to accept the new size threaded rod.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Reaminghingetubetonewsize.jpg
Like most of the keys the hinge tube is badly bent. Unfortunately reaming the key does not straighten it at the same time. The bend is found by inserting the hinge rod into each end and marking the place where it meets resistance. The area between the marks shows where the primary bend is located.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Markingtheareaofthebentsection.jpg
The key is then tapped with a plastic mallet at that location with the hinge rod inside the tube. That is very important! The plastic mallet I am using was made from a screwdriver handle and a drum stick. The trick is knowing which direction to hit the tubing and how hard. This technique sometimes requires a lot of patience.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Usingplasticmallettostraightenbenthingetube.jpg
Once the rod moves freely in the hinge tube, the ends are "faced" using a hinge tube cutter in the bench motor. Some techs like to do this turning the chuck by hand. I like to hit and release the foot switch and let the cutter "kiss" the key just before it comes to a stop. I seem to get a more even and controlled cut that way.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Facingthehingetubewithcuttingtool.jpg
The fit of the key between the posts is continuously checked as the hinge tube is shortened. One tries to find the "sweet spot" where there is no lateral motion of the key and no friction when it rotates.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Checkingthefitofthehingetube.jpg
Once the key is fit, the old key "dish" is removed using a cutting disk on a dremel tool. I found that a lid to a plastic storage box helped to keep the metal shavings from my face, eyes, and hair.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Cuttingkeydishoffbehindplasticwindow.jpg
The key cup from the donor key is unsoldered.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Unsolderingkeycupfromdonorkey-1.jpg
The key is put on the tárogató to determine the position of the cup.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Checkingthepositionofthenewkeycup.jpg
The outline of the rib is scribed onto the key cup to position it for brazing.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thepositionscribedonthekey.jpg
The "third hands" are used to position the key for braising.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Holdingthepositionofthekeyforbrazing.jpg
The last photo in this series shows the key after it has been filed, sanded, and buffed. All that remains is to degrease and nickle plate the key since a new roller and small threaded rod have already been made.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Keyafterfinishingsteps.jpg
The very last key on the tárogató posed a special problem in that no key cups could be found that would fit. Shown below is a very low tech way to make a key cup when one does not have access to a metal lathe. The material used is a sheet of .035" thick brass.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Circledrawnonbrasssheet-1.jpg
A circle is cut out using metal shears (or tin snips) which is then heated to anneal the brass making it more pliable.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Annealingbrasscutout.jpg
The photo below shows the brass disk next to a hole bored into a piece of oak using a Forstner drill bit that will be used to shape the key cup.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Annealedbrassnexttoholeinmapleboard.jpg
A deep socket slightly smaller than the diameter of the hole is used to force the brass disk into the hole. Remember I said up front that this is very low tech.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Forcingthebrassintotheholeusingadeepsocketandhammer.jpg
Below is the shape of the brass following this step.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thebrassaftershaping.jpg
The part is super glued to a wooden dowel to spin the "little brass hat" in the bench motor to cut off the "ruffles".
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Thecupportioniscutoutjewelerssax.jpg
The sides are then formed around the deep socket using a small dent hammer and the edges are smoothed by using a file as the cup which is now tight to the socket spins in the bench motor.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Shapingandformingthesidesofthecup.jpghttp://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Smoothingandroundingtheedgeswithafile.jpg
The key cup is still not ready to become part of the tárogató since its top is flat. All the other key cups have a slight curvature or dome on the top. Another low tech solution is found to help shape the top of the key cup. First pellets of Jett-Plastiform are heated in very hot water.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Meltingplastiformpelletsinhotwater.jpg
This forms a pliable plastic "goo" that is then rolled into a ball on waxed paper so it doesn't stick.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Plastiformrolledintoaballonwaxpaper.jpg
A wooden craft ball is pressed into the plastiform to create a bowl shape in the center. Did I mention this is real low tech?
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Usingawoodedbeadtoformabowlinplastic.jpg
When the plastiform cools, it turns into a hard white surface. The same wooden ball on a dowel is now tapped into the key cup positioned over the bowl causing the brass to conform to the curve.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Tappingthekeycupintobowltoconformtoitsshape.jpg
Here the rounded key cup is being checked for size on the tárogató.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Roundedkeycupcheckedforfit.jpg
This last photo shows how the last key looks on the tárogató after all of the finishing has been completed. Hooray!!! This part is done. The next installment will be about making and finishing toneholes.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t251/jbtsax/tárogató%20new%20key%20modifications/Misc038.jpg
Disclaimer: None of the above contains any original ideas. Everything has been copied or adapted from other techs that I have learned from.
I'm just wondering how long this will work - superglue has a habit of letting go if it's exposed to moisture over time. Epoxy may be a better bet.
We'll see. I'm not losing any sleep over it.
Loctite 406 was specifically recommended for this purpose - they use it to glue parts on flippers.
George
My mentor used to say, "Everything is fixable if you have enough money".
But your posts also demonstrate how much can be done with comparably simple tools that are powered by brains, imagination and workmanship. <bows>